Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/AKFD/content

Where does the information come from that the t-shirt incident with Bach was in 1989? I couldn't locate the precise date, and in fact the Rolling Stones article implied that it happened in the 1990s. Furthermore, the article on the band claims that he wore the t-shirt on MTV, is that confirmed? AxelBoldt 23:06 Feb 24, 2003 (UTC)

AIDS, it might be noted in passing, kills heterosexuals dead. AIDS kills women dead. AIDS kills Africans dead. AIDS kills people dead. Is there an article in Wikipedia about the logical fallacy of seeing the misfortunes of others as evidence of God's disfavor? If so, a link might help. -- Someone else 23:11 Feb 24, 2003 (UTC)

>Presumably, people who seriously use this slogan believe that the misfortunes of others can and should be interpreted as punishment from God.

This sentence is pure speculation, with no basis in fact, so I was compelled to delete it from site/sight.

Why do you claim it has no basis in fact? Did you research the issue? From Phelp's faq:

Why do you say "Thank God For AIDS"?

Because God is a sovereign God, and should be thanked for all of His righteous judgments, whether you like them or not. Everyone who gets AIDS gets it as a direct result of God's will (including babies and people who get it from blood transfusions), and He should be blessed for it. "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap" Galatians 6:7. You should follow Job's example: "Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the Lord gave, and the Lord hath taken away; blessed be the name of the Lord." Job 1:21.

As far as innocent people who get AIDS, God isn't bound by your humanistic standards of justice. Throughout history, He has killed innocent people to punish those people who are still living (e.g., the innocent first born of Egypt). And He's doing it today. God's wrath is being poured out on this world in many forms, including AIDS, and part of that wrath is the destruction of innocent people (including babies).

AxelBoldt 01:50 Mar 3, 2003 (UTC)

Quite simply because not everyone who uses or has used the phrase will have a belief in God. Birchtree

hostile?

I'm only interested in the slogan AIDS kills fags dead as a representative example of the kind of things homosexuality opponents say. If the article is to remain in existence, it should attribute the slogan to its creators and/or primary wielders (that Baptist crank Phelps, I guess).

Much of opposition to homosexuality contains a disturbing tinge of hostility towards homosexual people. I would like to distinguish "anti-gay" rhetoric and advocacy into:

plain old hatred of homosexuals, like calling them queers behind their backs or jumping them outside of gay bars, etc.; and
moral, religious, sociological & psychological ideas which presume or otherwise contend that homosexuality isn't a good lifestyle.

I try as hard as I can to stay out of first group, but I'm firmly in the second camp. Does anyone else see the value of the distinction I propose? I gather some will say no such distinction can validly be made: "principled opposition" is necessarily "hostile" -- but that is a POV which should be described and attributed in the articles same as any other POV. --Uncle Ed 16:01, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure that the distinction exists, altough sure I don't see enough of the second group on either side of this. Please do put something on this page about how this slogan is not accepted by all opponents of homosexuality ... maybe it'll do something to fix that funny-sounding "nearly all other churches..." disclaimer, too. — Paullusmagnus 18:30, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC) (P.S. You might want to check out http://wikiquote.org/wiki/Homosexuality and balance it out if you can &mdash it's all pro-homosexuality now)

The meaning of the slogan

The bit about the meaning of the slogan has changed several times now. Clearly it means different things to different people, so to assert any one interpretation would be POV. I have therefore edited the bit about its meaning to just say that it means that AIDS kills male homosexuals, which is the literal meaning. Obviously more than that is implied by those people who use the slogan, but any attempt to read those people's minds is doomed to failure... We shouldn't be putting our own interpretations of what beliefs motivate other people's words into articles anyway. If anyone who has used the slogan has explained what they meant by the term, fair enough, but attribute the explanation to whoever said it. -- Oliver P. 05:07, 17 Nov 2003 (UTC)